OpenJavaOffice.org... Sigh :-(

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OpenJavaOffice.org... Sigh :-(

Postby M-Saunders » Wed Sep 28, 2005 4:53 pm

Some of you may remember the whole OpenOffice.org / Java hoo-har that erupted earlier in the year. I wasn't all that concerned, because -- at least in OOo 1.1 -- Java added very little. You could do almost everything without it.

Today I try RC1 of OpenOffice.org 2.0. I fire it up, record a macro, and then attempt to play it back.

"Java is required for this feature."

Please, please! People! Such a basic feature requires an entire language, virtual machine, supporting libraries and more?! This is so utterly absurd I think it may be a dream. Yes, I can understand Sun's desire to spread Java, but making it mandatory for such elementary features is comical.

Couple this with memory usage and it's even worse. OOo is hardly the lightest program on the planet, and having to load a whole JVM on top just kills takeup on the tens of millions of mid-spec PCs out there. Many companies would love to ditch MS licensing and run a free alternative -- but when it runs like a dog on their machines, it's not so attractive. There are millions upon millions of machines out there in homes and businesses around the 1 GHz / 128 MB RAM mark. Yet this whole market opportunity is gone.

I'd understand if there were some massive new features that needed to be written in Java to save time -- as I believe is the case with the database app -- but simple stuff like this is scary...

Sorry -- needed that steam-letoffage :)

M
Last edited by M-Saunders on Wed Sep 28, 2005 4:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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RE: OpenJavaOffice.org... Sigh :-(

Postby Rhakios » Wed Sep 28, 2005 4:55 pm

Then you must be delighted to learn that the installer for SO8 requires a working JRE. Moreover, in the review I read the only distro they could get it to install on as intended was SuSE.
It seems that Sun are intent on getting Java into everything.
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RE: OpenJavaOffice.org... Sigh :-(

Postby M-Saunders » Wed Sep 28, 2005 5:00 pm

Oh dear! I think this highlights an important aspect of 'open source'. No matter how 'open' or 'free' something is, if one body has a large degree of control, it'll still be pulled in one direction.

From what I've seen, hardly any of the non-Sun OOo coders want to see Java in the suite. Especially with the licensing concerns. But we're seeing an entire language and VM wedged in at the most inappropriate places just to get Java spread around...

Well, maybe there'll be a fork. Even a partial rewrite of the suite would be welcome to clean out the bloat and cruft...

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Postby M0PHP » Wed Sep 28, 2005 5:16 pm

I mean, it's not as if Java is even a good programming language :oops: :lol: *ducks*
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Postby alloydog » Wed Sep 28, 2005 5:39 pm

Time to petition OO.o ?
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Postby nordle » Wed Sep 28, 2005 9:23 pm

A bit OT, but what does OpenOffice do, that you use and need, that Abiword + Gnumeric does not?

Im not saying one is better than the other, only that I've found the speed of Abiword + Gnumeric to be very good. But also, two of the GTK based apps where I actually like the interface, its feels right, whereas OOo seems muddled to use. Im not sure that's a valid point as it doesn't take long to learn how to use an app, but certainly Abi+Gnu seem to start off right.

Source --> Binary Package

Abi-2.3.99 = 27MB --> 4.5MB
Gnu-1.5.90 = 15MB --> 10MB

I realise thats not the point of what your saying, you want to use OOo and why does it have crazy demands, but Im curious what's missing from the others.....apart from pivot tables :)
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Postby Rhakios » Wed Sep 28, 2005 9:38 pm

Actually, the reason I mention SO, and indeed use it, is because it will print DL envelopes properly. Nothing that I have tried with OOo will persuade it to behave similarly, I can't imagine why.
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Postby nelz » Thu Sep 29, 2005 12:11 am

nordle wrote:A bit OT, but what does OpenOffice do, that you use and need, that Abiword + Gnumeric does not?


Have you tried creating a Powerpoint presentation in Gnumeric? :D

More seriously, I tried Gnumeric on some Excel spreadsheets that my partner has to use for work, and it had some problems with them, even after they'd been re-saved in OOo. A shame because Gnumeric is sooo much faster to work with.
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." (Albert Einstein)
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problem on bind

Postby thepikeman » Thu Sep 29, 2005 4:20 am

Recently I had a problem on my name server. As i started the named services, it give me this error:
"named daemon: illegal seek"
I dont know where would i start checking in my server..
and the named service looks like not working
Would it be advisable if i will going to install again the BIND on my server
Please Help... :-(
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Postby nordle » Thu Sep 29, 2005 8:57 pm

nelz wrote:
nordle wrote:A bit OT, but what does OpenOffice do, that you use and need, that Abiword + Gnumeric does not?


Have you tried creating a Powerpoint presentation in Gnumeric? :D

More seriously, I tried Gnumeric on some Excel spreadsheets that my partner has to use for work, and it had some problems with them, even after they'd been re-saved in OOo. A shame because Gnumeric is sooo much faster to work with.


The trick with the presentation is to have 50 slides, ie 50 gnumeric windows open at once and tab between them, with the amount of RAM gnumeric saves its possible. If you want scrolling effects, tab faster! :)

Fair point, but its still surprising how much the gtk versions still manage to do, Abiword can do html, pdf, latex, psion, outlook email etc over 30 save types.
It's got some nice features which even Office 2000 (bit old now I know) struggles with, like proper history tracking and document revision tracking.

Very weird with the Excel thing, I've found converting Excel+Word 2000 files has been far more successful in Gnumeric and Abiword than OOo (1.1.3). Except pivot tables of course.
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